Tomas
verb patterns Hi there! I'd like to ask native speakers how did you learn verb patterns? Is there another way to learn them than remember and practise each of them? How does it sound to you if you hear a verb followed by the infinitive or gerund incorrectly? Tomas :-)
Jul 26, 2014 1:31 PM
Answers · 11
We simply accepted the verb patterns as correct when they were spoken to us, or when we read them. The truth is, we know they are correct from having heard and used them thousands of times. Of course, some of us have gone back and analysed what we are actually saying, so yes there are rules even if the average native speaker is unaware of them. When I teach these verb patterns, I do take the time to explain the underlying concepts for these usages. May I ask, how does it sound to you if you hear české pády or české slovesa used incorrectly? :)
July 26, 2014
By the way Tomas, there is more to it than just learning the technical knowledge of a 'verb pattern'. There is the rhythm and intonations, the Rising and Falling of the tones which enhance memorization. To the mind, all speech is sound. All sound in speech is like a song. There is a rising and falling tone combinations. This is why English Teachers in foreign countries get students so screwed up in their understanding of language learning. The impress upon students that the way to learn is to acquire a technical knowledge of the language. It is an absurd approach to learning. Learning is acquired not by continual technical analysis of a sentence construction. (This is also why foreign students tell everyone all the time, that they are "shy" and do not feel comfortable trying to speak spontaneously.) Foreign students would have a much easier effort learning English (if not indeed, any language) If the learn the rhythm, or the "song" ...that speech is, in any language. Their memory would then work for them, rather than be excluded from some overactive intellectual process of analyses of sentence construction. I do not think about something called "verbal phrases" when I speak or write. All I do is construct complete sentence. . .
July 26, 2014
By listening and copying as children, and then spending the rest of our lives knowing instinctively 'what sounds right', but not necessarily 'why' it sounds right. English grammar is not taught in schools in English-speaking countries. In fact, 95% of the people in London, New York or Sydney have no idea what a gerund or an infinitive is : if you asked the vast majority of native speakers about verb patterns - even the most educated ones - they wouldn't have a clue what to answer. And yet we know what's wrong and what's right simply from experience. I don't know if you've noticed, but there are two kinds of answers that you get from native speakers on this site. Teachers, and people who have an in-depth knowledge of other languages, will give you explanations using grammatical terminology. Meanwhile, other native speakers will give you correct answers and appropriate examples, but not be able to tell you why something is right or wrong. Some of these might even say 'I can't tell you about the grammar'.
July 26, 2014
Su Ki is correct when she tells you that you will generally find two kinds of answers generally from Native Speakers. Some will offer you technical information about the construction of sentences with phrases and so forth. Others, myself included, may tell you that "I can't tell you about the grammar." That is because I did not learn English by "grammar" until the middle years of school. Before that, I learned from songs, poems, and reading children's stories whose phrases were memorized, even if not consciously memorized. Therefore, a "beginner" at self-expression in English, might be wise to heed the advice to learn English my memorization, or "rote--learning" in combination with their other learning methods.
July 26, 2014
"I'd like to ask native speakers how did you learn verb patterns? Is there another way to learn them than remember and practice each of them?"---Tomas I started by learning the songs they taught us as children. Here is a good example. YouTube.com will have a video showing you how it is sung. http://www.italki.com/entry/315884
July 26, 2014
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