Why "Donegal"? Sorry, the question might be slightly incoherent but it just woke me up in the middle of the night so I really have to ask it right now. Does anyone know why some initial mutations in

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Kseniia

Why "Donegal"? Sorry, the question might be slightly incoherent but it just woke me up in the middle of the night so I really have to ask it right now. Does anyone know why some initial mutations in Irish place names are not reflected in the English language? For example, Dún na nGall is pronounced as /ˌduːnəˈŋal/, so there is clearly no "g" here. Yet, "Donegal" is not a translation of the place name, so I suppose that the anglicisation was based mostly on the pronunciation. So where does this "g" sound come from? Was it written differently? Or was the name partly translated, like "Dún na Norsemen/Foreigners" (therefore, "Gall")? Or was it all different in Irish when the English language borrowed the place name (I doubt that eclipsis is such a new thing but who knows)? Or maybe the g sound in this particular combination (nG) can be more pronounced (i.e. more like /ng/, not /ŋ/)?It's not like the idea of place names distortion is completely new to me but I think it's not at all difficult for a native English speaker to say "Donenal" for example -> it's not because it's easier to pronounce the name this way -> it all doesn't make much sense. Béal Feirste -> Belfast, this I can understand. Sliabh Dónairt -> Slieve Donard, also understandable. But Dún na nGall -> Donegal? Why? What am I missing here?

9 de jan de 2019 19:27

Respostas · 25

It's something I have wondered about myself, though not to the extent that it ever caused me any nocturnal disruption. The first thing to take into account is that the anglicisation of Irish place names follows no consistent logic (though in the 19th century John O'Donovan of the Ordnance Survey did try to regularise many anglicised forms), so it shouldn't really come as much of a surprise to find some apparently inexplicable anomalies. In this particular case, I think the most likely explanation is probably that the anglicisation seeks to convey the radical form of the original Irish word, shearing it of mutations and other grammatical accoutrements. There are other cases of this kind of thing, for example Carrickbeg, Tramore and Tullamore: carraig, trá and tulach are all feminine so you would expect the second element to be lenited (-veg, -vore). Also Carrickfergus, where not only the initial mutation but also the slenderisation of the genitive case is omitted. Bear in mind that, when English forms were coined for Irish place names, it was generally done by people who had an understanding of both languages rather than a monoglot English speaker trying to imitate the name spoken by a monoglot Irish speaker. I hope that this will help you sleep better tonight.

10 de janeiro de 2019

I don't have an answer to this question, but as someone who is from Donegal, I am hoping someone else will have one. Some possible things to think about though are:

Donegal did have a former name: Tirconaill/Tyrconnell. This is named after the old rulers of the area. It was even the official name between 1922-1927. Clann Ó Domhnaill were the ruling clan between the 13th and 17th centuries, which brings me to my second point.

Perhaps Donegal doesn't come from Modern Irish. You may need to look at Early Modern Irish which was the form used between the 13th and 18th centuries. I know nothing about this form of Irish but I'm assuming that grammar rules and pronunciation weren't as set as they are for modern languages.

Another possible explanation is that the Anglicisation of the name came from the spelling of "Dún na nGall" rather than pronunciation. After searching a little, I have read that originally in English it was written in forms suchs as "Dunnagall" and "Dunagall" before settling on "Donegal".

10 de janeiro de 2019

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