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Telling the time in American English
<ol><li>It's quarter to eleven</li><li>It's a quarter to eleven</li><li>It's quarter of eleven</li><li>It's a quarter of eleven</li><li>It's quarter before eleven</li><li>It's a quarter before eleven</li><li>It's quarter until eleven</li><li>It's a quarter until eleven</li><li> It's quarter till eleven</li><li> It's a quarter till eleven</li></ol>
This is a companion piece to Nikola's question about 'quarter'. A question for speakers of American English:
Let's say your watch says 10.45. Other than 'It's ten forty-five', which of these would you say:
.... or maybe something else?
NB In modern British English, only #1 is used.
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Reading Girl's Language Clinic: Special offer
Just for one afternoon, I'll try to answer any English language questions which learners might have.
No charge.
No catch.
Just trying to make italki a more helpful and co-operative place.
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Around and about
First of all, many thanks for all the kind words written on Richard's recent thread. If you look closely at the girl with the book, you'll see that she's blushing even more than usual :)
Now for my question, aimed mainly at native speakers of American English. Not long ago a learner asked about the phrasal verb <em>messing about. </em>
<em>[Merriam Webster] Definition of </em>mess about.<em> British, informal. 1 : to spend time doing things that are not useful or serious : to waste time. We just messed about all afternoon. She spent the evening messing about on the computer. It's time we stopped messing about and got busy.</em>
Several American English speakers said that <em>messing about</em> was not a normal expression and "corrected" it to <em>messing around; </em>one said it was wrong, while another described it as 'regional' and 'charming'. Meanwhile, two South African English speakers said that <em>messing about </em>was perfectly normal.
These answers made me wonder whether this could be applied to other verbs, particularly verbs of movement, where <em>about </em>can be used as an alternative to <em>around. </em>For example, in British English, <em>walking around </em>and <em>walking about </em>are both widely used and have exactly the same meaning. There are many other verbs which can be followed by either adverb without a change in meaning: <em>playing about/around, running about/around, flying about/around, </em>for example.
What I'd like to know is whether there is a difference between British and American English in the usage of these two words. Thoughts, anyone?
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Can a non-native's English accent ever be good enough to pass as native?
Yes, but it is very rare.
Here's someone who fooled me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLtqE98qg_Y
Believe it or not, the actress in that scene is not a native English speaker. Impressive, eh?
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TV series DEVS: Question about American accent
We're all at home watching more TV these days, and I was wondering if any US members have seen the sci-fi series entitled DEVS. After watching the first episode, I was surprised to learn that the main character, supposedly a California-born Chinese American, was actually played by English actress Sonoya Mizuno.
This is my question:
How convincing is Mizuno's accent? Can you tell that she isn't American?
To my ear, she sounds very convincing, and I would never have guessed she was British. But I'm aware that we're hardwired to notice differences rather than similarities : I can hear all the features of American English that I'd expect to hear, and none of the English English ones. But I'm wondering if the opposite happens when an American English ear listens to her. Do any of you, as American English speakers, notice any English English influences which sound wrong to you and give away the fact that Mizuno is putting on a 'fake' accent for the series?
Your thoughts on this, or on any other accent-related issues, would be very welcome!
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Common mistakes seen on italki. Mistake #1: You cannot train a language!
<ol><li><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);">to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/teach" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>teach</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> someone to do a </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/particular_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>particular</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/job_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>job</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> or </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/activity" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>activity</em></a></li></ol>
Let's take a look at what the Macmillan dictionary has to say about the transitive verb 'train':
train someone [to do something]:
<em>We </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/need_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>need</em></a><em> to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/recruit_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>recruit</em></a><em> and train more </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/police_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>police</em></a><em> </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/officer" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>officers</em></a><em>.</em>
<em>They were </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/training" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>training</em></a><em> him to use the </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/new" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>new</em></a><em> </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/security" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>security</em></a><em> system.</em>
<em> 2. </em><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);">to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/teach" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em> teach</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> an </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/animal_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>animal</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/obey" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>obey</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> you or to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/perform" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>perform</em></a><em style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"> </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/trick_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 0);"><em>tricks</em></a>
train something [to do something]:
<em>I </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/want_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>want</em></a><em> to train my </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/dog_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>dog</em></a><em> to </em><a href="https://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/roll_1" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>roll</em></a><em> over.</em>
As you can see, we train people and animals to do things. You can train an employee to do his or her job, you can train an athlete to run faster or hit harder, you can train your dog to fetch sticks for you.
But, try as you might, you cannot train a language. However patient you are, you cannot place your language ability on the desk in front of you and coax it to do anything. You cannot teach your language ability to jump up and down, or to do tricks like a circus of performing fleas.
You can practise your English with your italki language partners. With luck, you will hopefully improve your English in this way. But you can't train it.
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Butchering the English Language (with thanks to Richard)
See https://www.italki.com/discussion/232670
6 kwietnia 2020
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Indian members? Name suggestion needed, please
I'm looking for suitable name to give to a (fictitious) performing arts company: a group of Indian dancers and musicians based in the UK.
It needs to be a nice-sounding one-word name in an Indian language. For copyright reasons, it ideally shouldn't be a name which has already been given to a company of this type.
All suggestions gratefully received!
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A message for new teachers and community tutors
Let's start with a question. Imagine yourself in this situation:
Imagine you're a tourist, just arrived in a strange town. You need to find your hotel, so you ask a friendly-looking passerby for directions. All you want is to be told "It's the second street on the right" and then you can go on your way.
But then suddenly someone rushes up to you trying to sell you a map of the city. Someone else barges in and tries to sign you up for an expensive guided tour.
How would you feel? Not good, I suspect. You ask a simple question and suddenly the vultures descend, trying to make money out of you. If you don't speak the local language well, you might not even realise it at first. You might mistake the opportunistic tour guide, out to make a quick buck, for a well-meaning passerby who genuinely wants to help.
Getting the picture?
By all means, answer learners' questions and build up a reputation as a helpful and reliable language resource, but please don't use the community pages as advertising space. It's a fairly crass thing to do, and the community here takes a dim view of it.
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Yet another myth about the English language: among versus between
Subtitle:
Common mistakes seen on italki. Mistake #2: Misuse of AMONG.
Let's start with a question. Which of the following two options is correct?
A What's the difference between X, Y and Z?
B What's the difference among X, Y and Z?
Hands up. Who thinks B is correct?
If you think is B is correct, you're almost certainly a non-native speaker of English. You chose option B because your teacher or grammar book taught you to use 'between' when there are two elements and 'among' when there are more than two. You think that option A is wrong, because you shouldn't use 'between' when you're talking about three things. Is that the case?
Well, unfortunately, this 'rule' is one of the many myths about English, one of the many 'facts' that are taught to millions worldwide but which turn out to be wrong.
In fact, the correct wording is "What is the difference between X, Y and Z?". This is because you are asking us to consider each of these elements individually, and to identify the difference between X and Y, between X and Z, and between Y and Z. You cannot use 'among' in this context.
Here's a dictionary definition of 'among':
1: in the middle of or surrounded by other things
The flowers are hidden among the roots of the trees
Detectives searched among the wreckage for evidence
2: happening or being included as part of a group of people or things
The problem is most widespread among teenagers
A 20-year-old Canadian woman is among the victims
Those are correct examples of how to use 'among'.
Remember - the difference between 'among' and 'between' is not merely a question of number and it is always wrong to say '<s>the difference among</s>..."
I hope you found this useful!
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