Alex
Wanna make Russian grammar nazies angry? Use some -ТЬСЯ -ТСЯ.

Hi, everyone!

I have an English speaking friend here on italki. And the other day she came across with a sacred topic about Russian. Someone mentioned some hardships when using -ТЬСЯ -ТСЯ in Russian verbs.  My friend had no idea what it is, so she asked me to clear it up. I wrote her an essay on this topic and she liked it so much so she even asked me to make a post about it.

I am not sure whether it has any importance indeed for -ТЬСЯ -ТСЯ can't help anyone to become fluent in Russian. Actually it is just feature which makes people look  professional at writing in Russian. If someone can't master it - that would not make a big deal. And I am really sorry if this topic is boring for you. I will just copy my text from that message with the slightest corrections.

Okay. So about -ться/ -тся. This topic is about advanced level of Russian, but anyway.
I will start from a distant point. Russian is very rich with endings, suffixes and prefixes. That is why the order of words doesn't special matter in this language. Take a look at this: Winter is coming. In English you may use only this single option unless you are magister Yoda. Winter is coming. That is all. But in Russian it may be: Зима наступает. or Наступает зима. Both ways are equally legit. Because due to endings and suffixes and prefixes you can easily see who is about to come. The same is about any sentence in Russian. You can scatter verbs, nouns and adjectives almost any way you like all over the sentence since you use proper forms of any word. Some order of words would seem rediculous, but it would be OK anyway. Also slightest differences of meaning would take place. In any case the common point of sentence would be caught.

That is why endings of Russian verbs are so important. One cannot lose or misuse them - it would change the meaning. The similar feature is in German too, though they have direct word order like in English. Their infinitive always ends with -en: lesen, lachen, schreiben, springen, singen, gehen and so on. 
In Russian most of verbs end with -ть or in their infinitive: шагать, ползти, знать, видеть, бежать, идти, падать and so on. But there is another ending for infinitive: -ться. -ться means that the action is being made towards the subject itself generally. Мыться - to wash oneself. Краситься - to make up your own face (about a girl). Купаться - to bath oneself. Забавляться - to joy oneself. 
But holy s**t! There are so many exceptions so we can say -ться is added to verbs which imply being invoved into any process. Look at this: Улыбаться - to smile, to wear a smile. Драться - to be involved into a fight, to fight. Кусаться - not to bite oneself, but to bite in general sense.

to be continued below....




28 июня 2016 г., 8:31
Комментариев · 28
3

For those who are not sure there is a rule: ask a question about the verb. If the question sounds ЧТО ДЕЛАТЬ? (What to do?) then write -ТЬСЯ for ДЕЛАТЬ has this Ь in it. And if the question is ЧТО ДЕЛАЕТ? or ЧТО ДЕЛАЮТ? (What does do? What do they do?) then write -ТСЯ for there is Ь neither in ДЕЛАЕТ nor in ДЕЛАЮТ.


28 июня 2016 г.
2

Vincent, the rule is MUCH simpler:

-т is third person singular.
-ть is infinitive.

-тся is third person singular + ся (the accusative of 'self').
-ться is infinitive + accusative of 'self'

Literally reflexive form of a verb (e.g. 'do') means 'do themselves/herself/himself/itself'.
The way it modifies the meaning is not really simple:
- mutual action (Маша и Петя целуются / мы целуемся с Машей - about two people kissing),
- reflexive...
- just as a way to make intransitive verb form a transitive verb.
- Or as a way to switch focus from the object to the state/condition/occupation of the subject:
Я целуюсь с Машей - "I'm kissing-self with Masha" makes one think of me, occupated with the kiss. My feelings etc. Я целую Машу "I am kissing Masha" makes one think about me, performing an _action_ on rather passive Masha. Stepping forward, taking her with my hands etc. Also it is applied to people  kissing cheeks and foreheads, obviously:)
- etc.

Now, what people confuse is -ться and -тся. Third person and infinitive.
Just because they sound the same. The closest English analogy is their/there.

Without -ся -т and -ть sound differently.

28 июня 2016 г.
2
The rule seems to be simple, but many Russians do not feel it naturally while they do not have enough time to use this algorithm every time they have to write such a verb. So they do not care and use -ТСЯ or -ТЬСЯ randomly. My wife is one of such Russians. And she can easily become an object of Russian grammar nazies' hatred. These grammar nazies love -ТСЯ -ТЬСЯ for it is a perfect subject for them, especially because spellchekers hardly can catch this mistake.
That is all.
28 июня 2016 г.
2

Now you probably see. Everyone knows how to say it, but not every native speaker is sure whether it should be -ТСЯ or -ТЬСЯ. Some people have it naturally. I feel when it is not a personal form, but an infinitive so I automatically write -ТЬСЯ. And when I speak of some person, I know that he улыбаеТСЯ (smiles). So I write -ТСЯ with no hesitation.


28 июня 2016 г.
2

Every verb has a special ending anyway. And I used to be so surprised when I found out that  English verbs had no special endings. Put, fly, walk, kindle, swear - all they have nothing in common. So you need the direct word order to make it easier. Otherwise it would be difficult to figure out where is a verb and where is what.

Well, Russian verbs have special endings in infinitive. One of these endings is -ться. Ok. But the problem is that many verbs have very similar endings when they are about third persons (they, she, he, it). This ending is -тся. See samples. Собака кусается. Дети учатся. Мой друг улыбается. Упаковка легко повреждается. And so on. -ТСЯ again, but without Ь. The thing is this f***ng Ь cannot be caught when hearing.




28 июня 2016 г.
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